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Revan is Female by SmileWhenDead Revan is Female by SmileWhenDead
Revan is female. Nuff said.


Template by: :iconluckylooke:

Edit: This is a warning, any comment about how "Lucas Arts owns this" or "Revan is male" or "blah blah blah" will be deleted, marked as spam and hidden. Comment sexist bullshit at your own stupid risk.

For those you ass hats saying Revan was cannon male, you are WRONG. Revan can be whoever the fuck you want Revan to be. The only reason there is Cannon is for MEDIA and Bioware did want Revan to be Female but Lucas Arts went the Male way for MARKETING! Don't believe me? Google it.

If you don't like the stamp, kindly stfu about it. This is also NOT a sexist comment since I am MALE! So shut the fuck up you fucking asshat haters. I fucking swear to God you fucking guys who are like this, I bet you don't have girlfriends. :P

Also, this is a post on the Lucas Arts board made by a female gamer. She is the reason I think we need more STRONG FEMALE CHARACTERS IN GAMING!

"First off, I'd like to state that the Gender of both Exile and Revan were both done for commercial means to give them a Gender. Technically neither of them have been given a canon Gender, but needed one in order to put the character into wiki/books/commercial/ect. I have the article somewhere and I'll fish it out if needed.

Revan:
Now, I will agree with Allronix on female Revan. After playing male and female, female just somehow had a deeper story that gave every character more meaning. It gave Juhani a back story (even though they cut it from the game), gave so much more conversation with Carth into his character and yet you still got to know practically everything there is to know about Bastila as well... just without the love. It gave the hidden ending, and for the first time in really Star Wars history it gave a women a chance to take up the plate as an incredibly strong character instead of the still typical short sighted or overly harsh women.
I've played all 4 possible ways to play Kotor and I believed completely, and still do, that Revan was a Canon female due simply to so much more content. Believe it or not, I only found out in about the last month that Revan is "supposed" to be a guy after years of playing.

Allignment? My personal belief is that Revan does not have an allignment. Malak says it, Revan's story says it, Kreia says it. There is no canon proof at all, but I believe Revan to be Gray Side Female with Light Side Kotor ending.

Exile:
As I think most of us can agree, TSL needed a lot more work. Personally I place Exile as female as I feel that creates a stronger bond between her and Kreia, and to also be more of a Light/Gray Side. No mean to sound offensive in any way possible, but I also believe that the personal exile, cutting oneself off from the Force that completely, bonding with everybody that easily, and becoming that emotionally detached would come from more of a devistated female than male. Again, no means is that an attempt to take any sort of jab at men.

Mical: Overdone in fics, but he is a nice source of info, opinion, and relationship. He should have followed the male Exile regardless, even though the Mical works better for female.

Brianna: This is where I believe TSL lost out more. I personally believe Brianna follows the Exile regardless of Gender, but gets closer to the male than female. She would be a great character to bring the Exile to a better understanding of personal strength and will of mind regardless of Gender.

Sion: The fact the Exile, as a female, has so much affect on him and eventually redeems him is so incredibly Star Wars I can barely express it. In the Telos Restoration Mod Sion gets more dialog and options to help the Exile that were not there previously that give the feel this was how it was supposed to be... to me anyway.

The gender specific characters joining the party or not was a huge disapointment to me and the second I get TSL for PC I'm grabbing the Brianna female mod. I believed that Juhani situation pushed it a little, even though I am highly highly disapointed they cut her backstory, but full on characters not joining or not...*sigh*. Cutting so much of the canon and lore into two seperate pieces is absurd and should never have been done.

I'll admit it, I'm also biased to Star Wars for always making the male the honorable hero while the women get stuck with bad dialog at times and simply little to do but sit back and watch the men deal with everything.

Here is a quote that I think is beautiful in all rights, summing up why I choose to play female as a female:
Yes, this seems like another ackward an ill-placed post. But I believe those who read my work should know this: I DO try as much as possible to work every and all official Lucasfilm/arts sanctioned bit of information upto a point: that point being a female Revan character—the choice to go canon on this character given the multiplicity of male heroes in the Star Wars genre irks me, and therefore will never earn my support—unless Lelan Chee recants and there is a female Revan doll along side Barbie who can take her mask off and you can dress up. I don’t agree with the idea of cliche = canon as a Star Wars fan. The male hero cliche is old and over used in the Star Wars genre. If its creator is to be true his vision, then he will allow for change, otherwise the SW genre will be forgotten not by unwilling fans but by its own creator.

As a woman I used to dream of reading every Star Wars book to my children—but I refuse to send the message to any of my girls that they are less able to become heroes simply because George Lucas says so. That is my rant—girls by the Force can bear life—and by the Force and in the service of the Force they more luminous beings… my fic reflects this
This is Star Shadow's fic btw and it is one of the most brilliant things I have ever read: [link]"
Add a Comment:
 
:icongoldenfreddy1:
GoldenFreddy1 Featured By Owner Edited Jan 3, 2015  Student General Artist
Revan is awesome, no matter what gender he/she is.
Reply
:iconmtibbs-89:
MTibbs-89 Featured By Owner Oct 11, 2014  Student General Artist
I agree with this. Sadly, the books/TOR sorta shoot this down, but the game (KOTOR) itself seems to back it up completely.

I also prefer female Shepard as canon, either romancing Garrus or nobody. Don't know if you play Mass Effect, though...
Reply
:iconxaprilyne:
xAprilyne Featured By Owner Sep 13, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
I know it's canon, but....

LOOK AT ALL THE FUCKS I GIVE. JUST LOOK. 
Reply
:iconzoanaak:
Zoanaak Featured By Owner Aug 20, 2014
No, he is not. You see his face in SWTOR.
Reply
:iconmysteriousswordsman:
MysteriousSwordsman Featured By Owner Aug 15, 2014
ill allow this if we trade ravan as a female and make the exile male :p
Reply
:iconrocketman399:
rocketman399 Featured By Owner Jun 23, 2014
not according to the cannon. swtor says it all
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Well, my head cannon is greater than a sexist cannon. Thanks pal!
Reply
:iconcompcube:
CompCube Featured By Owner Jun 6, 2014
SCREW CANON AND DREW KARPYSHYN
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
SCREW THE CANNON!!! RAWR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply
:iconarchsteel:
Archsteel Featured By Owner May 28, 2014
XD I managed to completely flip the game around. I played Revan as a woman and the Exile as a man... Woops.
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
I did the same thing!!
Reply
:iconarchsteel:
Archsteel Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014
XD
Reply
:iconkal444:
kal444 Featured By Owner Apr 16, 2014
Listen I agree that the games and series that involve Revan do feel deeper when the character is female, as well as The Exile.
But I'm sorry to say, Revan is male and The Exile actually is female (Meetra Sulik).  Hell Revan and Bastilla have a kid (it's touching really, the book that is.  Revan goes out and sacrifices his life and centuries more of pain at the hands of the real sith for both his wife and kid so they don't have to.  Name of the book is Revan, personally thought it was great, try it.)
And please it's not sexist, it just is.  As well as the media taking a large turn towards more female protagonists and antagonists, not all are stellar, but hey nothing's perfect.
But like I said it'd be better if Revan was female, 'specially in the games.
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Dude, you lost me at "Revan is male". Not in my head. Revan is and always will be boss ass bitch to me.
Reply
:iconjelna:
Jelna Featured By Owner Jul 25, 2014
I love this book! And you are right.
Reply
:iconvampirehunteramanda:
VampireHunterAmanda Featured By Owner Mar 2, 2014  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
I'm a dude, an FTM to be exact, and I totally approve of this. It always bothered the hell out of me that there were little to no huge game-changing women in SW (unless one counts Darth Lumiya or Kreia). Women and men deserve to have awesome female heroes!

*salutes*
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Sweet! I too am FTM so it's nice to get a comment from another person who is as well. Sorry for my late reply!! We should totally be friends or something because you sound awesome!
Reply
:iconvampirehunteramanda:
VampireHunterAmanda Featured By Owner Aug 19, 2014  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
:icongwompplz: FRIEND MODE ACTIVATED! :D
Reply
:iconelsacoperson:
ElsaCoperson Featured By Owner Oct 17, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
YAY!
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Oct 22, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Glad to see more people agreeing! Thank ya kindly for the comment!!
Reply
:iconsidhre:
Sidhre Featured By Owner Aug 30, 2013
my revan is male and likes to give juhani lots of love <3
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Sep 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I approve of this!
Reply
:iconsidhre:
Sidhre Featured By Owner Aug 30, 2013
and now i just fucking missed the F and the E.... i should stop drinking while on the internet, forgive me. D:
Reply
:iconjediknightcjr12:
JediKnightCJR12 Featured By Owner Aug 29, 2013
sorry, it's been confirmed that Revan is maleThis probe's for you! STFU you idiot! STFU you idiot! 
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Sep 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
I don't give 3 flying fucks if it's "cannon". It's sexist. Get over it. Revan can be whatever fucking gender Revan wants cause it's motherfucking Revan. Check and mate.
Reply
:iconjelna:
Jelna Featured By Owner Jul 25, 2014
Sorry but.. why it's sexist? It's just cannon and yeah.. Revan and Bastila are married. Do you call it sexist, because you don't like it?
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:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
(sigh) No, it's sexist because they took a strong character who is very versatile and made it MALE. Why? There was no reason in the world other than typical geek male privileged morons making the decisions. I cannot even begin to get into this because the complexity of our social structure may break your brain.  
Reply
:iconjelna:
Jelna Featured By Owner Aug 16, 2014
No need to be rude, man. A female Revan would be nice, but I like the male version too. It's nothing so important.
Reply
:iconchatterbox010:
CHatterBOx010 Featured By Owner Aug 26, 2013  Student Writer
This is simply beautiful!! Not only the picture (F***ING EPIC!!!!:XD:)
But also the description :D I honestly had no clue that Revan was supposed to be female, so when I read it in the description, I literally put my laptop down and told my brother (who didn't believe me :P)
I really love the picture :D It makes a new high for amazing-ness :)
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Sep 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thank you! Yeah, bioware had intentions of making her female but lucasarts (which is no more lol) had other thoughts. In my own head cannon, Revan is female and always will be female. I played as male a few times but the female Revan felt right to me so I wanted to make a stamp for others who believe the same. However, I've been getting more sexist comments then I would like. D:
Reply
:icondejectedosprey:
DejectedOsprey Featured By Owner Jul 19, 2013
It's true that it really doesn't matter if Revan had a dick or not, because they practically told us that in the beginning of the second game. Even though I'm a guy I must say there aren't enough female protagonists...
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Sep 16, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Exactly my point! There is a serious lack of female protagonists in not only the Star Wars universe but in media period. It's something we need to change! 
Reply
:iconimaplode:
Imaplode Featured By Owner Mar 29, 2014
What about Leia, Padme, Visas, Bastila, Satele, Ania, Tenel Ka, Tahiri, Meetra Surik, Ailyn Vel, Sintas Vel, Mitra Gev, Aayla Secura, Jaina Solo, Shaak Ti, Yaddle, Nomi Sunrider, Castilla Ming, Mara Jade, Barriss, Luminara, Siri Tachi, T'ra Saa and Sabine?
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
Leia was wonderful... in the extended universe. Now, I am not going to knock Leia because of the time period she was considered a good female character because it was the 70s and there was no one else! Well, minus Wonder Woman but that's a separate argument all together. Anyway, Leia was good for her time but she lacked things that could have pushed her to the status of great female hero. They didn't really pay much attention to Leia's powers or the fact that she was more than just "strong female character with a pistol oooo". We see her grow in the extended universe to become a very powerful Jedi politician. That road could have began in Empire Strikes Back but instead, because of the time period and the men writing it, they didn't even fathom that possibility. That's a little insulting. Don't you agree?

As for the others, as wonderful as they are, they do not get enough exposure. People should give a shit about how boss of a bitch Jania Solo is but they don't. The fandom love for her and the others is a little low. I hope that more women get inspired by those characters and continue to create REAL female heroes.
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:iconimaplode:
Imaplode Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014
Can't argue with that!
Reply
:iconzucca-xerfantes:
Zucca-Xerfantes Featured By Owner May 31, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Amen, Smile. Amen.

Every single piece of IN-GAME content strongly suggests Revan and Exile are both female. All these other posters who are saying 'Well in the stupid-ass book nobody cares about, Revan's a male lol!' I quote the Wise Mr. Plinkett when I say 'I don't care what's in tha fucking book! I'm talking about the movie!!'

And frankly, I loved Star Wars books up until they brought in the You's Hung Vaughn or whatever the frack they're called, killed Chewie, Ithor, Anakin, Jacen, Wedge, Qwi, Mon Mothma and essentially ran my childhood through the mud by saying 'Remember all those wonderful characters you grew up with? Let's see what happens when we take a dump on them all!'

Anyway, made a journal alluding to the female angle right here [link]
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Jul 6, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
Thank you! Finally, someone else gets it.
Reply
:icontherebeunicorns:
therebeunicorns Featured By Owner May 24, 2013
I must say I would love it so much more if Revan were female, but even though I am female it doesn't bother me THAT much that Revan is canon male for marketing. It was their choice to make him male as creators and I respect that.

Though in the end, I will never play kotor as male Revan because I am in love with the female story-line...I try to picture the male story and it just doesn't come close for me. Now if they really loved me Revan would be female and in love with Bastila xD But that may be asking a bit too much. I love the Carth romance/story, but I am lesbian and thus preferred to romance Bastila.

I haven't read the book and based on it's reception I don't plan on it but if they made a Revan movie (I'm dreaming again) ever, I wouldn't mind if Revan was male, I'd still love to see a movie version of kotor regardless.

"The male hero cliche is old and over used in the Star Wars genre. If its creator is to be true his vision, then he will allow for change, otherwise the SW genre will be forgotten not by unwilling fans but by its own creator."
--- I definitely agree with this point in the respect that in the future it would be wonderful to see a female SW heroine/villain save/destroy the galaxy. And I mean a female heroine/villain that is taken as seriously as a male and not sexed up. It's one thing to have a pretty heroine and another to sex her up ridiculously to appeal to male fans.

I'm not a huge Star Wars fan that knows everything about the universe, so I don't really want to debate as I probably DON'T know as much as the big fans. xD
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner May 28, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
The reason I was upset is because I wanted them to finally include a strong woman who wasn't afraid of anything. I'm a bit of a feminist even though I'm male. I think we have far too many male heroes for little boys and not enough female bad asses for the girls. Know what I mean? Bioware wanted that but LucasArts cock blocked them. What's frustrating is that I can't find the article that spoke about that. It was the telling of how LucasArts took the character from Bioware. They were the ones who created Revan in the first place. Kinda dick if you ask me.

I'm pansexual myself so I loved all of the romances. I put in a patch to make my female Revan fall for Bastila. I even painted them together on the Light Side for the their victory. Revan turning her good with the will of love and the force. Oh, just so bloody perfect! I'm a bit of a romantic.

The book was rubbish. You're smart to avoid it. I would like a movie but only if they go with Bioware's intention of a female Revan. ;)

Tell me about it. I'm glad that they didn't sex up the female versions of Revan and for the most part SW females are strong. If you are looking at the alternative universes. The books are quite good. I would recommend reading the stories of Leia and Han. Their kids are quite wonderful. :)

You're fine. You gave me a concise opinion and I truly respect you for it. :)
Reply
:iconjelna:
Jelna Featured By Owner Jul 25, 2014
Sorry for bothering but.. Why do you think the book is rubbish? And I understand your opinion a little better now. But Meetra is a strong female hero.
Reply
:iconsmilewhendead:
SmileWhenDead Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2014  Hobbyist General Artist
It's not so much that I believe it to rubbish, it's more the fact that I find most of the writers to be dry and sexist. I rather see more of these extended universes written by women. We have enough male writers telling their stories.
Reply
:iconbtisaac:
BTIsaac Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2013
Yeah, personally I found female Revan to be more interesting as well, though I usually define Revan as male when playing TSL - I figure one sex-change is enough messing with the timeline, considering how ironically, I also cannot immagine Surik as anything other than male.
Reply
:icondictionofgame:
Dictionofgame Featured By Owner Mar 26, 2013  Hobbyist Digital Artist
Dont be a bigot. Comments that are sexist should exist. Otherwise we have a dystopia of intolerance. Disagreeing isn't bad, censorship is.
Reply
:iconfirestarawesome:
Firestarawesome Featured By Owner Mar 13, 2013  Hobbyist General Artist
This is so god damn true.
Reply
:iconjediknightcjr12:
JediKnightCJR12 Featured By Owner Feb 24, 2013
Actually revan has been confirmed to be a male ever since star wars the old republic came out
Reply
:iconlaindonathletic:
LaindonAthletic Featured By Owner Feb 23, 2013
Revan is a kick ass male who can't be killed but if you want a kick ass female then it is Lighting from final fantasy. I can see why you would what Dark Lord Revan Saver of the Republic to be a female because he is cooler than cool. The argument you used state Revan is female "Revan is female. Nuff said." is one of the best lines I've heard or read. My mate Bobby still asked the most funnest thing of "How do you spell GCSE?". Now you found that funny or think my friend is an idiot. May the force be with you, always.
Reply
:iconzucca-xerfantes:
Zucca-Xerfantes Featured By Owner May 31, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Lightning from Final Corridor?

*Stomach churns* Blegh...

Final Fantasy hasn't really done it for me since the SNES days. I can't stand Lightning.

Revan was, in the first two games, STRONGLY implied to be female. In the second game, Revan is presumed to have been female unless you correct Atton when he speaks of her.
Reply
:iconlaindonathletic:
LaindonAthletic Featured By Owner Jun 3, 2013
Read the books and play Star Wars the Old Republic MMORPG he is a male. George Lucas and his staff state that he is male in the end so his male. Atton Rand is what some people may call an unsuccessful player; he never gets to see Revan's face so he would hope for a woman.

Lightning is cool; she is kick-ass. My favorite final fantasy character is the best blitz play Kyou.
Reply
:iconzucca-xerfantes:
Zucca-Xerfantes Featured By Owner Jun 3, 2013  Hobbyist Writer
Really? George Lucas said Revan is male? Really now? How about some proof?

And while you're at it, maybe proof outside of the book nobody cares about and the unsuccessful, bombing MMO that deserves to burn in a fiery abyss?

And maybe proof that Lightning is 'cool' and not a genocidal, easy-to-manipulate, dumb-as-a-brick TOOL.

She's on the cover of the damned game and she doesn't have a story arc! It's the opposite with Revan. Revan wasn't on the cover of *her* game and *she* was the most important character.

In fact, I've got time... and you lied to me on the wrong day, pal.

Firstly, Lightning's game makes no sense!

I'm sure you are shaking your head and chuckling; after all, the Final Fantasy games are not especially known for making sense. But even in Final Fantasy X (where, I might remind you, the story was about the dream of a dead young man traveling to the future to fight his father who had turned into a giant Godzilla/Whale who punished people for their sins) the story might have been batshit insane, but I could still follow it.

I spent the first 20 hours of FFXIII not knowing what the fuck was going on or why the heroes were doing anything, thanks to the world's worst collection of fantasy proper nouns (the 'heroes' have been turned into L'Cie by a Fal'Cie and might turn into a Cie'th? Good God...). But when I finally deciphered what the hell was going on, I realized that the characters also didn't know what they were supposed to do! Save the floating world of Cocoon or destroy it? Now, I'm all for ambiguity in my stories, but 25 hours is a long time to not have some kind of discernible goal.

Next issue I have with Lightning's game. The liniarity!

[link] This is a map assembled by mightier nerds than I, of the FFXIII map for the first 5-6 hours of gameplay. As you can see, it is for all intents and purposes, a straight line. Having played 25 hours, I can assure it that it never deviates from this straight fucking path -- oh, it might twist and turn a little, but it's still a tunnel, with absolutely no alternate routes or choices to be made. If you enjoy RPGs because you enjoy exploring worlds, FFXIII screws you especially hard, because you have absolutely zero choices of where to go... for the first 25 hours; I'm told the game actually has a world map and opens up later, but I'll address that below.

By the way, Final Fantasy XIII has no towns, no shops, no inns, and practically no other characters besides the players and a few antagonists. It is the least epic world that has ever been featured in a Final Fantasy, and it enrages me to think about. Square Enix can pump all the graphic wonder it wants into the setting, but it's all flat and lifeless and totally unmemorable, partially because you never get to look around.

Next, the combat...

Much has been made of FFXIII's new Paradigm Shift system, which assigns each character a class, and has you switching those classes on the fly. It sounds cooler than it is, because all you're doing is switching classes, watching the two other characters in your party do the one thing you told them to, and hitting "Auto-Battle" over and over and over again so that your player also fights. It's horrible, boring, and gives you the least control in any previous FF game.

Seriously, in Final Fantasy XII, you had to program your NPCs with the annoying Gambit system, but 1) you still got to control your own player's actions, and 2) you could program the other characters to perform a wide variety of tasks at different conditions (it was phenomenally stupid that you had to buy these commands from a store, but whatever).

But in FFXIII, the players can only do one thing at time; their job, which can be attacking, healing, another type of attacking, offensive status spells, defensive status spells, and "sentinel"; unless you "shift" "paradigms. Ignoring the fact that FFXIII's battles move quickly and shifting paradigms can take up valuable time -- and ignoring the fact that your other two characters have to change jobs unless you've made paradigms that are exactly the same except the one alteration you want to make... wait, don't ignore that. That's really horrible. Plus, you only have six paradigms to choose from at a time, so there's no way you can have your characters do exactly what you want.

Speaking of, even if you have them doing the job you want, it doesn't mean they'll do it how you want it. Let's say you have Vanille set as a medic. Can she do anything other than heal? NO. Can you pick who she decides to heal? NO. Does she generally pick the character with the lowest HP, and not necessarily the character who's under attack? YES. Would you like her to stop casting "heal" after everyone's actually healed? YES, BUT SHE WON'T. Would you like her to do anything other than cast "heal"? THEN YOU HAVE TO SHIFT PARADIGMS AND CHANGE EVERYBODY'S FUCKING JOB EVEN THOUGH IT'S A HUGE WASTE OF TIME!

And that's not all! There are three types of fights in Final Fantasy XIII: fights with regular enemies you can win solely by hitting the "Auto-Battle" button over-and-over again (yes, it's called the Auto-Battle and it picks your actions for you, so you can be even less consequential to the game); boss fights which last long enough to require some "paradigm shifting" and perhaps a token bit of strategy; and finally, fights which regular enemies who are rendered needlessly powerful in order to make you use FFXIII's horrible system.

Think about it; if you had one person on your team solely devoted to healing, to automatically casting cure with his/her every action, and the rest of the team was attacking, should you lose any non-boss battle? Assuming you hadn't wandered into an area beyond where your characters should be (an impossibility, thanks to FFXIII's perfectly linear setting design), wouldn't that mean that these regular enemies were doing more damage than you could possibly heal? The answer is yes, and FFXIII has them, solely to make you use the otherwise useless Sentinel class and the status casters. It may not sound awful, but really, the game is making itself needlessly harder just to justify its own stupid combat system, and that's broken.

If you don't agree, then how about this: the game evaluates you on all of your fights both with a score and a star ranking. Hilariously, the score is meaningless! If it's added together somewhere, I don't know where it is. The star ranking, 1-5 stars, is based entirely on how fast you defeat the enemy. Meaning the fastest you can possibly beat an enemy is if you have all three characters attacking. Meaning not healing or dicking around with status magic. Meaning the game punishes you for using its own bullshit combat system. Whee!

The 'Moms are tough' thing in Lightning's game is bullcrap.

At the beginning of the game, Hope's mom decides to go help the rebellion/jailbreak/whatever, telling Hope that "Moms are tough." This is a well and good enough line, but in the proud tradition of Japanese sexism (Sexism like making the girl on the cover have no plot arc while the chowderhead who punches giant robots with his bare hands gets the more developed plot), she repeats its two more time before she's obviously killed. This is terrible writing, and the staff should be damned ashamed.

Lightning and her party are uninteresting and stupid.

Final Fantasy XIII features six characters in your party: two are okay, and four are awful. That's not a good ratio. Sazh and Fang are the only two characters that are even slightly likeable, although Fang is exceedingly Australian for no discernible reason. The remaining four characters are unfortunately more prominent than Sazh and Fang, and thus their awfulness is only emphasized. Lightning is an enormous bitch to everyone, even to the point of abandoning children in the fucking wilderness. Snow is a moron, running his mouth about being a hero with absolutely no comprehension of his or others' situations. Vanille, also oddly Australian (I'm not dissing Australians, it's just weird for two fantasy characters to be randomly Australian) is shallow, bubbly, ignorantly joyful, and upsettingly sexualized despite being 14 or something. And then there's Hope, the 13-year-old boy who could give Evangelion's Shinji a run for codependent, emo mopiness. Blaming Snow for the death of his mother (I guess moms aren't that tough, thanks Square-Enix) but absolutely refusing to confront him about it, for no reason other than to pad out the game. FREQUENTLY collapsing to the ground to whine, complain and moan. He is irredeemably awful.

How is this different from, say, the sullen Cloud of FFVII or the outright jerk Squall of FFVIII or the oddly laughing Titus of FFX? Without trying to go into a massive nerd diatribe here, I'll say that Cloud starts as more a gruff Han Solo-type , and his emotional breakdown only comes later, and is an integral part of FFVII's examination of heroism and the story arc itself. FFVIII's Squall is certainly a jerk, but the game is essentially about him accepting others, so starting as an aloof bastard makes sense. As for Titus, apart from some serious daddy issues, he's generally cheerful and optimistic, facing oblivion with dignity. But two points I would raise specially: first, in both FFVII and FFVIII, there are other non-jerk, genuinely likeable characters to take up the slack. If if you can't stand Cloud or Squall, there's Tifa, Aerith, Cid, Barrett, and Rinoa, Seifer, Quistis, etc. Furthermore, Cloud, Squall (and even the rest of the characters mentioned) have actual pasts and backstpries that make them interesting. For all intents and purposes, all six FFXIII character's lives begin 13 days before the game starts and a fucking fireworks show, which I know because the game keeps flashing back to it from everyone's point of view, as if it's interesting or relevant.

These characters have no depth and, thanks to the horrible (lack of a ) story and no discernable motivation, it's impossible to root for them, like them, or care about them. I hate them. Especially Hope. Oh, and you can't get distracted with other characters, because there are maybe three bad guys who maybe appear for 30 minutes of the game's first 25 hours (most of that being a single boss fight) and maybe three NPCs, two of whom are shown only in flashback and all of which are dead. No one else. Not a single other character in the entire game, not a single other person to talk to. Epic!

The enemies in Lightning's game suck.

There are five enemies in FFXIII, not counting bosses. There are soldiers, some kind of robot knight-thing, some blobs, some tiny things, and a giant armadillo thing. They might have some mild variations; different colors, or the soldiers might have jetpacks, but they're pretty much repeated almost exclusively. Again, this is the least epic Final Fantasy game I've ever played.

And need I remind you that our 'heroes' all mow down soldiers trying to protect the citizenry and take them in *ALIVE* by the metric fuckton. I'd rather play a game about these soldiers trying to capture this gaggle of lunatics playing coin toss on whether or not to destroy the world!

And the bosses? Well, they're Final Fantasy X's monster designs taken to its extreme -- meaning they're all indecipherable messes. They're practically Transmorphers! They're all needless ornamentation and sharp angles and no ability to tell where they're faces are, except for one boss who has four faces (none of which are his real face) ARGH!!

Lightning's game has a crappy equipment system.

Since there's virtually no exploration and shops have been relegated to a menu screen at save points, the normal equipment system has been utterly removed. Would you like to find more powerful weapons and armor and items? Too bad. In fact, there's no armor at all, just some accessories that provide extra HP. Each player has 8 weapons (and only 8) which can be "leveled up" by some incredibly arcane process of gooey materials monsters drop. Would you like to level up someone's weapon? I hope to god you have enough of all the totally random materials needed to do so.

Half the fun of playing RPGs is making your characters more powerful, and a large part of that is equipment. FFXIII manages not only to take away more options on how you can actually customize you character, but turned the entire process into massive busywork. Again, none of it is automatic; all equipment leveling must be done by you and only with the proper materials. If that sounds more fun that exploring a cave for the legendary +10 Masamune sword of Magnificence... well, it doesn't. And it isn't.

Lightning's game screwed up the summoning.

The Summons have long been a Final Fantasy highlight. Since they're so cool and special, acquiring them is supposed to be something important, something special. So how does this sound; you have to defeat each Summon to acquire them, but not necessarily by combat. You have to fill up a gauge by healing a partner, or using the Sentinel paradIgm, or pulling off combos, or one of several various conditions... with no clue whatsoever what to do. Other than die, and replay the fight over and over again until you happen to stumble upon the answer. Or pay $20 for the strategy guide. Does that sound fun to you? If so, then you need serious help.

Lightning's game has a stupid level-up system.

Final Fantasy XIII, for no reason whatsoever, decided to do away with the standard RPG experience points-leveling system. Instead, it uses Crystarium points, which are exactly like experience points but stupider. Seriously, it's exactly like experience points; it's how you gain Strength, Magic, HP, spells, everything, except you have to physically press a button to make it happen instead of it happening automatically. And don't think it allows for some cool customization thing; each Crystarium path is practically a perfectly straight line, exactly like the world, with only a few tiny branches to make a pretense of customization. Also, it's presented three-dimensionally making it needlessly hard to navigate, forcing players to constantly adjust the camera to even use the damned thing and all for what equates to a straight fucking line.

Lightning's game has HIDEOUSLY childish storytelling.

I proudly tell people I play RPGs for the stories. The Elder Scrolls all have environmental storytelling, like you're getting swept up in events and are doing your damndest to keep your wits about you. Fallout, from the first game to New Vegas is always about YOU and what YOU are doing to make the crapsack world marginally more tolerable to live in. FFX was very bizarre and not particularly deep, but it was fun and had a real heartache of a conclusion. Breath of Fire (2 and 3 in particular) are rich with storytelling! 2 being about a boy's search for his lost family only to discover bigger and graver things at work and 3 being about a child who learns he is heir to a secret the world will kill to keep. But Final Fantasy XIII is a mess. I told you of the awful characters, of the ridiculous names that all include "Cie" in them, that even at 25 hours the players have no idea what their goal is whatsoever. But FFXIII can't even tell this awful story right.

Of FFXIII's first 25 hours, I estimate maybe 8 full hours of it has been cut-scenes, cut-scenes which don't advance the story ever, because no one fucking knows what is going on. They are clumsily forced into the game at every opportunity; you can't get through a single map without at least three of them popping up to waste your time. They're never short, and they're never meaningful. It's just another chance for Lightning to be a titanic bitch, Snow to be a jackass, Vanille to prance around disconcertingly, and Hope to collapse to the ground, put his head between his legs, and whine. You can't build any momentum as a player as you're constantly getting interrupted, and you're constantly bored as a viewer because all the cut-scenes are horrible.

It boggles my mind how Square Enix could do this. No matter how much you like or dislike their games' individual stories, they've always been wonderfully paced, especially with the gameplay. Final Fantasy XIII is like a sad parody of FF games. It's a shitty story told ESPECIALLY poorly.

Lightning's game gets good after 25 to 30 hours?!

I've had several people tell me that Final Fantasy XIII gets really good, yes sirree bob, once you get past the first 25-30 hours, that the world opens up with plenty of side quests, that you can actually explore some of the world, that the combat finally gels together. Whether I believe them or not is totally irrelevant, because even if they're right, I think that's worse than if the game sucked all the way through.

What the fuck do you mean I have to sit through 25-30 hours of shit before it gets good? When did this become acceptable? Why can't a game be good from, oh, I don't know, the fucking beginning? I managed to sit through four hours of Roxas bullshit in Kingdom Hearts II for the promise of the Tron world. I dealt with the island of the giants in BoF2 and not having the great bird after Gate opened. And now, Square Enix wants me to wait 25-30 fucking hours before the game gets fucking decent?! FUCK AND NO. I don't care if it turns into a straight re-make of Final Fantasy VII at hour 30, that is bullshit and real blackmail to Square-Enix' fanbase. A worse insult than Advent Children.

Lightning's game represents thirteen years of void.

Final Fantasy X came out in 2001. It was a good game. Lots of fun. FFX-2 was terrible, but a necessary cashgrab from a studio still reeling from the financial debacle that was The Spirits Within (Though I loved that movie). Final Fantasy XI was an MMORPG, utterly worthless to people who enjoy regular Final Fantasy games and enjoy an epic story. Final Fantasy XII was made by the crazy Final Fantasy Tactics guy who had a nervous breakdown/got fired somewhere near the end of development; the result was an odd game with its wacky combat and largely forgettable (but coherent) story, and it didn't feel like a proper Final Fantasy game.

Square Enix has announced that Final Fantasy XIV will be yet another MMORPG, potentially due out later this year. So you're going to have to wait until Final Fantasy XV for even the chance of a decent Final Fantasy game. Assuming it only takes four years to make FFXV (that's the time between 12 and 13, and I don't believe 14 won't delay it) it will be 2014 before you can even potentially play a quality FF. That's 13 years since the last good Final Fantasy game. Thirteen years, fella. And there's no guarantee FF15 won't suck either.

Lightning's game failed to please me, and I'm notoriously easy to please.

Anyone who knows me, understands that I'm very easy to amuse. Easy to please. Even with a shabby story, I can usually find some good. I'm a born storyteller and I know when my time is being wasted. The movie called Manos: The Hands of Fate has a scary enough story! It's just the execution that's weak.

All of this, while a long hammering of FF13, is to point out how sorry a character she is.

I've seen some LP's of the game and even after the covetous thirty hour mark, I remain woefully unimpressed! And that sudden, out of nowhere epiphany of hers that's supposed to net in a lot of sympathy?

Sorry, no, just not happening...

Lightning as a female protagonist is a cold, emotionless robot who had about as much appeal as a bland, uninteresting hunk of ice. She doesn't react to anything and has no environmental feedback. She leads a group around, murdering scores of people for the vaunted quest of destroying the world.

Stupid. Dumb. Boo.

It's been nearly ten years since KoTOR came out...

Revan, as a female protagonist can be a saint or a sinner as you see fit, but she's always *engaging*. She's a brilliant mastermind who had to run athwart history to save everything she knows and holds dear. To look at her spirit is to look at the burning, beating heart of the Force. Her quest involves either revenge or salvation, but always it's interesting to watch unfold.

Even today her story is amazing to watch unfold!

Lightning? In ten years, who will give a crap about her?

Not I, and I'm willing to bet, not you.
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:iconlaindonathletic:
LaindonAthletic Featured By Owner Jun 8, 2013
Is that it? You sure you don't want to say that i missed the er in player and say Kyou is a bad blitz ball player. You really don't like Final Fantasy XIII (or me maybe). Never say bad things about the books because they came around because people wanted to know what happens the Revan after the game. The MMORPG is brilliant for about 4 hours and then you start think that there are much easier ways to mission you have to do, and if you go evil as a jedi you should gust be able to join the sith (and the other way around) but can't. The only good thing is the MMORPG tells us what happened to Revan after the books. This gives us knowledge and any knowledge is a good thing it is one of three pillars in the jedi order (other two are the Force and Self-Discipline).

I can't say much without this turning into an online war. I will standby what I say and you will stand by what you say. I do not want any bloodshed between us; I did not comment to offend anyone but i seem to have offend you so sorry. I don't want to be your enemy; probably can't be a friend after this, so neutral then. So can we agree to disagree, or what?

P.S. If you haven't played Balder's Gate: Dark Alliance II you should.

P.P.S. May the force be with you.
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